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Dean Review Consultation Questions

Written submission to Dean review

Submission number: DR-43

Name of individual making submission: DR-43 Tony Lorini

Responses to questions in submission form


Section A - The Public Interest in this Review

1. What do you understand by public interest?

Citizens of the province with special attention to the needs of the trades.


2. Who should the College serve? Who is “the public” in the public interest and what groups make up the public?

The College should serve the trades. The public is citizens of the province. The groups would be the government, trade association (contrators, unions, journeymen), and interested citizens and professionals.


3. How should the College make decisions in the public interest where different segments of the public may have opposing interests?

The College decisions are to represent the trades. Opposing interest must factor generating consensus to develop a strong economy for the trades.


4. Is the College currently protecting the public interest?

The College is legitimizing the trade training needs for the economy. Its enforcement policy is bringing comfort to the public.


5. How should the College advance the public interest?

The College will advance the public interest by educating them through out programs, media relations and Government support.





Section B - Issues Related to Scopes of Practice (SoPs)

6. What impact do SoPs in regulation have on your daily work activities or on the way you conduct business? What aspects of an SoP are important to the work of your trade? Please explain.

Sops define our traditional work practices in business. What's important to our trade is to keep SoPs' brand and add a compulsory industrial aspect to the SoPs.


7. Do you agree with the suggestion that trades may have core elements as well as peripheral elements?

Yes, the core and peripheral elements are part of our trade. Our trade has evolved as products and technology have grown and improved.


8. What should be the key elements of an SoP? In particular, should the SoP for a trade list all of the tasks, activities or functions in which an apprentice should be trained, only those that are unique to the trade, or only those that may pose a risk of harm to the public, tradespeople or other workers on the job? Please explain.

The key elements of an SoP in our trade should have a broad list for training and safety.


9. How should a review or change in SoP be carried out?

The trade boards should carry the SoP reviews with the professional expertise of its own business, unions, and journeymen.


10. Can or should the existing SoP provisions support the College’s diverse functions (e.g., apprenticeship training, enforcement, classification reviews)? Please explain.

Our SoPs' provisions are continually being enhanced to educate the College about our needs to be a distinct painting trade to serve the construction industry with qualified journeymen.


11. Should the entire SoP for a compulsory trade be enforceable or be subject to enforcement? Please explain.

It should be enforceable to have our qualified skilled journeymen handle technical and hazardous safety issues.


12. Could the College benefit from a distinct list of compulsory activities that may pose a risk of harm to the public, tradespeople or other workers on the job? Please explain.

Yes, the College can benefit from compulsory list of activities for the Trade's public safety and having knowledge, accountability, and integrity of our trade.


13. What is your understanding of what an overlap between SoPs is?

An overlap between SoPs is where at least 2 trades do similar jobs - i.e. drywall and painters repair walls.


14. Do overlaps between SoPs in regulation have an impact on your daily work or on the way you conduct business? Please explain.

Overlaps in SoPs can interfere with daily work and business especially if contracts specify parameters for quotes and maintaining a journeyman's job and time to complete projects.


15. Does the application of the third legal interpretation principle on overlapping SoPs pose a risk of harm to the public, tradespeople, or other workers on the job? Please explain. If so, what can and should be done about it?

Overlaps create the risk of adding and losing traditional duties of the trade. Each trade wants to add to its SoPs. Further review might alleviate these situations and protect jobs.





Section C - Classification or Reclassification of Trades as Compulsory or Voluntary

16. What makes a compulsory trade compulsory and what makes a voluntary trade voluntary?

Compulsory trade is licensed and enforced building code is a requirement.


17. Is the current classification of trades as either compulsory or voluntary aligned with the College’s duty to serve and protect the public interest?

The current classification of trades by the college still needs to be updated to truly measure the needs of the industry.


18. Is it reasonable to assume that there may be elements in the SoP for a trade that are inherently hazardous or that may pose a risk of harm to the public, tradespeople, or other workers on the job?

Yes, there are hazardous elements to SoPs for a trade which underscores the importance of proper education and training.


19. Could compulsory certification be limited to either the core elements of a trade or those tasks, activities, or functions that may pose a risk of harm to the public, tradespeople or other workers on the job? What kind of impact would these approaches have on your daily work or on the way you conduct business?

There should be compulsory certification in our trade. In business this would require proper designation for those that pursue the compulsory route.


20. Should the College continue to rely on an adjudicative review panel approach (i.e., the Ontario Labour Relations Board model) or should a different model be considered? Please explain.

The O.L.R.B. ad College will have to find a common ground of enforcement separation and not to make one party ineffective over the other.


21. How should expert opinion be obtained?

Expert opinion can be voluntary through Trade Associations.


22. Are the current criteria for trade classification reviews set out in O. Reg. 458/11 consistent with the public interest? Please explain.

We need to keep trade classification reviews up to date to meet public demand due to changes in the construction industry.


23. Are the criteria specific, clear and measurable enough to inform you of what data and evidence are needed to meet those criteria?

The criteria for review is very cumbersome.


24. Are the existing criteria the right criteria?

The existing criteria fails to measure qualified journeymen that aren't registered by the College. This doesn't help the College get a true picture qualified trades person. This needs to be accounted in industry data.





Section D - Decisions of the Ontario Labour Relations Board (OLRB)

25. Do the scopes of practice (SoPs) in regulation reflect the way in which work is actually assigned in your trade or sector?

The SoPs regulation are not up to date in our sector.


26. Do you agree with the notion that most jurisdictional disputes arise from peripheral elements of the trades? Please explain.

Jurisdictional disputes arise from changes in our industry to get greater economic revenue in business. More business and trades persons are fighting for economic survival.


27. What consideration should the College give, if any, to the decisions made by the OLRB in jurisdictional or work assignment disputes under the Labour Relations Act? If the College were to adopt the OLRB's decisions, what impact would that have on your trade and the way you conduct business? Please explain.

The College should follow OLRB jurisdictional dispute review process to maintain uniformity.





Section E - General Response and Comments

28. Please provide additional comments below, if any.

1) The paint trade board is requesting a compulsory industrial coating designation. 2_ The Government should enforce its procurement jb tends to certificated qualified businesses to legitmize the OCOT Development. 3) The College should "grandfather" and protect certificate of qualification journeymen before OCOT's inception to opt in for a true trade assessment of skilled trades.